Combating the Climate Crisis by Protecting our Shores – Marcus Whitney LIVE with Blayne Ross
Blayne's company www.shorelock.com is doing great work to reverse the concerning trend of coastal erosion. People like Blayne give me hope for the future!
Where to watch live:
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MW
what's up
Marcus Whitney's audio universe Marcus
would need live how's everybody doing
today I was a little bit bummed out I
have to admit when I saw the case case
count today for Kovac 19 but I am
working to lift my spirits today and to
stay positive and stay focused about
what we can do to build a new normal and
along those lines we have an opportunity
to get out in front with innovation and
heart and intelligence and
entrepreneurship to solve another big
existential problem that we have as
humans on this planet Earth another one
of these big global issues and I'm
really excited to have today's guest on
to talk about this this is my new friend
entrepreneur and sort of global global
advocate for ocean health my man playing
Ross Blaine what's good man
BR
hey thank
you so much for having me on Marcus I
really appreciate it and
MW
glad to have
you on glad to have you on
BR
down here
sweating with everyone else in Miami
this summer
MW
yeah so really quickly we're
gonna focus on everything that that
you've got going on but really quickly I
do want to just ask last night I was
watching CNN the mayor of Miami was on
CNN sort of talking about everything
that's that's happening there in your
city you know I see you sort of overruns
or feel like imminent you know just as
someone who's actually living in it you
know what's what's what's your your what
can you tell us about what's going on in
Miami
BR
yeah I think the the climate down
here has really kind of changed
we were very lackadaisical about it it
seemed like at first and you know there
were there was the request to wear masks
and and whatnot and and you probably see
maybe 30% of the people that were kind
of wearing them and then as things
started changing a couple weeks ago
I mean they put the county put in a
masking mandate everybody's you know in
the masks and they're paying attention
they're not getting together as often I
think we were a little slow on the whole
Beach thing and not not they opened them
up and they shouldn't have I think
because it's really hard to go to the
beach you want to wear a hot mask and
it's just the behaviors you're gonna be
next to somebody so yeah unfortunate did
it happened but they did correct that
and we're back - I really hope improving
MW
yeah I hope so too the the numbers were
startling so you know my my thoughts and
prayers with everybody down there and
you know hopefully things get back to
normal as soon as they can just in terms
of people being able to get out and
about okay so so with that let's let's
talk about you and let's talk about your
your venture sherlock just give a quick
background on you and you know sort of
who you are personally professionally
and then we'll jump into your business
BR
all right cool personally I grew up here
in Florida this is Jacksonville as my
home originally and I'm a big water guy
I've been out whether it's water skiing
or sailing or doing anything it's always
water and Beach related and it just has
been since I was a little kid and you
know when you start thinking about
things in your life that are important
you know this has always been one of
them for me is being able to be outside
in the environment and so I you know get
myself into triathlons occasionally and
I've got a new puppy I'm raising so that
we can be outside and running around
just doing that kind of stuff and I've
kind of had a big life shift this has
been a big change for me I was up in New
York for the last 11 years and I kind of
pursuing some of my creative passions
which has been you know wonderful and
fulfilling and I've got some neat things
that are my belt from doing that and I
got kind of to a point where I thought
you know I really want to start changing
and doing something that's like I can
have an effect on the planet and I can
bring more and you know soul-searching
will do that and that's kind of where
you know I led into work a little bit
this is what I'm doing now that way
MW
yeah
so so let's let's talk about the the
issue the problem that you that you
found
we start talking about the business in
the solution because admittedly with the
pandemic going on you know I I seem to
be completely focused on covert 19 is
like the only existential threat we
could possibly be facing and everything
is doing to the economy and to our
communities and to people but you know
we we have had this debate going on for
quite a while now about climate change
and about the rising sea level and about
the impact that that's going to have on
our society on on our economy on our way
of life you know just to give us just a
basic background on what's at stake and
what's happening right now
BR
or so I think
the best way to approach this is is that
you know we're - we're at a point in
history where our technology is really
advanced and we can now monitor and
really see what is actually happening
with the seas I don't think that the
climate the climate change conversation
should be I feel this way or I feel that
way it should be here's the data this is
what's actually happening and that
should be the way that you make
calculations and changes about what
you're going to do in the future the
empirical version of it is living in
Miami because we have a full moon and a
king tide which for those of you guys
that are not familiar is a high tide at
a full moon and when that happens the
streets of Miami down to Miami Beach
will tend to flood you know you'll see
news clips all over the all over the
place
you know we've got 18 inches today we've
got 8 inches today you know that's just
empirical evidence so there's no arguing
with that we have to drive through it
people stall their cars out in it so you
know if the sea levels are rising it we
have to start really thinking about how
we're taking care of a process and one
of the things that has been a continual
issue is coastal erosion the ocean is
gonna do its thing it's gonna come in
each time the wave goes back out let's
take a little sand with it and there's
two different ways that you can handle
it you can either go
suck up the ocean floor or and dredging
and put the sand on the beach or you can
go to a sand mine that maybe somewhere
off several hours away and truck it in
those have been the two-bit main issue
ways that we've taken care of things
occasionally we build Rock groins which
are like jetties they're a little
different but similar you know the
things like that are they're hard
engineered structures and they have
their own positives and negatives you
know when you put something there you
can change the change the flow of water
and actually make your erosion worse in
another area so we've been doing things
the same way for a long time and now
we're at a point where we've run out of
some of our natural resources like sand
is now I believe the third most valuable
mineral resource that we have is
something again Miami a great example
they've dredged so many times there's
not sand right off the coast of Miami
Beach anymore so they have to truck it
in you know that's that's a very good
example and real for what's happening
and it gets more complicated to farther
up to the state and into other parts of
the country so that's just kind of I
think a little bit of the big picture is
that with the majority of the world's
population living within you know a
couple kilometers of the coastline we
have to start looking at alternative
ways to protect this because it's a
problem and it's coming
MW
yeah so so let's
go back to what you just said
The
majority of the Earth's population
living, you know, near or on the coastline...
Like what, I I don't think most
people think about that. Although I think
if you think about the most populated
areas in the United States, it's
certainly not the middle of the country.
It's definitely you know sort of on on
the coast. But but talk talk a little bit
more about that from a global
perspective, like because I don't think I
really had thought about that, although
it makes a ton of sense.
BR
Yeah, well start...
I mean you start looking at it from a
standpoint of trade. So originally the
reason we were on the water is
temperatures and trade. You want to be
able to get go out and fish, and to sell
your fish, and to move your fish to the
next town. Or to be able to launch your
army or to be able to just move goods. So
that's always going to be the densest of
any any country if
you are not a landlocked one, then you're
on the coast, yeah.
MW
Yeah okay okay. And and
and today, what what percentage of people
like live on on or near the coastline?
BR
I hate using the percentage on this one because
-I've seen it and it's been a little
while, so don't uh misquote it- I would
say it's somewhere it's it's somewhere
between 48-55%.
MW
Yeah that's... even if you're in
the universe -even if it's 30%-
it's really really big. It's a big number.
BR
Yeah yeah yeah you know it's it's it's a
massive number. And you know, every every
different area has a different condition
that's going on… I mean you have places
that have sea walls. You have places that
are soft beach. You have places that have
a natural coastline, and each one of
these things has to be handled a little
bit in a unique way. There's not a
one-size-fits-all prescription for this.
And it is really about each, the
leadership in each city, really going
after and trying new things and and
seeing what's working and having a
conversation. Because that it... when you're
going into a place that's the like where
we were with COVID and a pandemic, you're
in reaction mode. But with the
environment right now, you we can be
proactive about some of the things that
we're doing. And then thank god for
private foundations stepping in and
funding scientists and engineers to try
things, because that's the way we move
forward. That's how we, you know, protect
trillions of dollars of real estate. If
you even think for a second that
not not protecting things
isn't gonna cause massive financial
problems, you just be you know missing
the boat.
MW
right right so so your business
you talked about sea walls and that's
like one of the sort of standard
approaches to dealing with rising water
it's like just build a wall right okay
that makes sense your business has taken
a more scientific approach to how we
might be able to deal with this natural
occurrence which is ocean erosion which
may be exacerbated by climate change you
know and some some more severe weather
patterns that we're experiencing right
BR
yep exactly you know for thousands of
years kind of Engineering's been the way
that we
we handle things and that's by
physically doing things and what
Sherlock is doing is actually taking as
you mentioned a science approach
developed by a microbiologist named dr.
Troy Scott and he really wanted to look
at it from how do we optimize nature how
do we start using what we've already got
and just make it a little bit better and
that was really the initial concept for
how this idea was born and to explain it
briefly it really is when the waves come
in to shore and then they retreat they
may be pulling backs and almost like the
way you're peeling back layers of an
onion okay pretty simple yeah but what
we're trying to do is say okay well if
that wave is also taking away sand why
is that happening can we can we improve
that a little bit and so what Sherlock
does is it's a powder and we mix it in
with the wet zone of the beach from the
high tide to the low tide mark very
little of it actually and what that does
is allows the wet sum to absorb just a
little bit of water and let the water
retreat back to the ocean below the
surface level of the sand it stabilizes
and in a very cool way in some places if
we have seen in the Bahamas and in
Jamaica that it will accretes and if new
sand is out there moving around in the
near shore we've seen over ten inches of
sand added in elevation to a beach and
up to about 15 or 16 feet and width
naturally Wow
so there's some opportunity here to for
us to continue to learn with this and
and and hopefully proactively start
managing things
MW
so I so I have to just
relate it to the pandemic because I
think one of the most frustrating things
about this is that we have apparatus in
place with the World Health Organization
within our country that has outposts in
other countries the CDC you know the
executive branch should be having a
pandemic team in place to sort of you
know have a standard operating response
to these sorts of emergencies when they
when they come this is this feels like
this feels similar insofar as
the impact can be global it can be
really really significant from an
economic perspective and it could be
massively disruptive to our lives in a
way that we're not prepared to sort of
deal with the aftermath of and so it
feels like we we really have to take a
proactive approach unless we want to
have something massively disruptive
happen as a result of it so my question
is how does that how does that
similarity play out for you as an
innovator in the space today you
mentioned private foundations that are
stepping in to sort of help some of this
stuff happen
I recently learned about
the term the “blue economy” which is, you
know, the this this wave of companies
-probably some that already existed, I
guess like oil companies I guess fit
into the blue economy- but it's any
company that's focused on the ocean. So
that would be a comp... that would be what
you would fit into. But what does
innovation look like in the blue economy?
What does it feel like to be a founder
in the blue economy? Like who are you, who
do you have to work with, and are the
dollars flowing in this direction like
they should?
BR
Good question. So on on the
innovation side of the ocean and there's,
a ton of stuff coming out right now. We
are really, really starting to go after
things that have to do with the ocean,
and exploring it, and robotics. And you
know, things like what we're doing and
how to grow coral, and that... it's all
fantastic. I'm very excited and enthusiastic
about where we're headed.
The interesting part about being an
innovator -especially when you're coming
into a new space- is unless somebody has
been out there, and I say do this more
for myself, unless somebody has been out
there and really made your thing an
issue, sometimes you feel like you are
the little guy standing in a very large
room just yelling, “hey look at me over
here! I’ve got something that can help!” And
and that's always, that's a funny is a
funny place because I think of myself
often as a taxpayer, and an
environmentalist, as well as being a
business owner. And my my business
owner self is like really trying to make
the rational presentation when I'm
having these conversations with people, and
then when they're not getting it, the the
average citizen in me is standing there
going, “you are wasting so much capital and
like environment, and all money... and
why are you not taking this guy
seriously?” That that makes me crazy.
So I think that when you get into
new spaces, doing new things, that that's...
I'm not the only one that's ever felt
that, but that that's gonna be happening
in our space and explaining why things
are relevant.
MW
yeah I mean you know I hear
you and I think from a pure business
perspective that makes complete sense
the idea that if you're in a nascent
market meaning you know a market that
hasn't really like taken off you you
have the job of educating people but I
agree I agree with you in that it's one
thing if you're talking about you're
introducing a new sock that keeps your
feet cooler 10 to grease cooler okay
that's like you have to educate people
when you're talking about the shoreline
it's like it's our earth you know what I
mean it's it's our it's our planet and
to me you're dealing with something
different you're not dealing with just
educating a market you're dealing with
cognitive dissonance you know what I
mean you're dealing with trying to
effectively communicate an economic case
when people want to stick their fingers
in their ears and their head in the sand
like how do you and look you may feel
like it's it's inappropriate for you to
make any comments because you're trying
to win win friends and and and influence
people positively I can sort of talk
about this because I'm not into space
right but but but it is it is it is a
different form of the innovators dilemma
for me when you're an innovative is
trying to do something that's actually
going to help humanity and you can't get
people to pay attention and the in the
the the downside of not at least taking
your meeting or considering what you're
what you're talking about doing relative
to all the other solutions that are
currently available is so so significant
it's like the downside of me not buying
these like you know cooler socks is not
that big a deal you know what I mean but
the downside of me not figuring out how
to slow
or reverse coral erosion is like this is
my my children's future this is you know
what I mean like this is a very very
different thing so anyway I went on a
bit of a soapbox there but I just would
I would find it really difficult to be
an innovator and a founder and an
entrepreneur in in your shoes
BR
you know I
I was filing because I had a
conversation yesterday and I tend to
like to call this the already always
listening syndrome in the people assume
that they already know what you're
talking about so they turned you off
before they've listened to actually
being able to say yes and I was on the
phone with a government person yesterday
and she said well III just you know
she's by the way we've they're doing
conversations around this for two years
in this particular deferment sure she
was law I just don't understand why
someone would want to cement the beach
together and I said there's no aspect of
what we are doing that cements the beach
together and she said will you make sand
particles attract and I said yes but you
can't feel it it doesn't make a
difference to the way that it looks or
feels to them to an animal or to a
Fisher to a plant or it to a human you
know here's all the data but she just
for two years just suddenly was for the
first time actually willing to go oh you
mean you're not turning the beach into
cement oh okay that makes sense like it
was just little light bulbs and they're
in and I think that sometimes when we're
having those conversations in a new
space people already think they know
what you're talking about yeah I think
made their might yeah you know
MW
yeah I
mean that that that is why things like
this like continuing to you know
continuing to hone your story hone honed
the way that you're communicating it is
so so important because people do
connect dots if you don't explicitly
connect them you know what I mean they
they do sort of come to conclusions if
you don't help them get really clear on
that so okay so talk to me about you
know where your where your business is
today and and where the market is today
you know like you're you're in Miami
you're on the ground you're having these
ongoing
worse with with with folks
obviously people are very very you know
overwhelmed with the kovat situation
right now so I would imagine there's a
lot of distraction and you it's probably
harder than ever for you to get people
to pay attention but generally speaking
like are you generating revenue are you
actually putting your solution and
practicing in the market right now like
like where where are things in this
space
BR
yeah
so the company was started as I
mentioned a few years back and then kind
of put a put on put on hold and the good
news is is that we've got over a
decade's worth of pilots that have been
down in the Caribbean that show us
environmental impact and studies and
helping how it behaves and what it does
in the Caribbean environment so that
that part's fantastic but we have not
been actively out there you know pushing
the sails button we really what we
wanted to do is come into Florida first
and set things up and we had we had such
an interesting circle that happened here
which was the municipalities have to
sign on to sponsor a project in order
for the environmental for the DEP to
sign off on something but the DEP or the
but the state won't sign off until the
municipality signs on so it was the
chicken and the egg thing and I actually
after going through that for an entire
year went to one of our state
legislators and said okay let's try and
get a state pilot's state sponsored
pilot lit so that that takes the
pressure off the municipality and we're
doing this tiny little thing you know
just just enough to make sure everything
is by the Florida standard and you know
we as a company are completely confident
that we're gonna pass that with flying
colors and so we started with that and
just to tell you a little bit about the
importance of what what we're dealing
with here aside from us being at a about
a 40th see just paused weird about 62%
of beaches washing out between 2 and 5
years and now I want you to know that
we've got we've got a budget of 737
million dollars is what's supposed to be
spent in five years so
MW
I need
to rewind to the to the three to five
year thing you just said yeah yeah yeah
cuz dude that's that I'm not excited
about that what you just said so say
that one more time I want to make sure I
understand what those words mean
BR
yeah
So a beach the way that we are
projecting at the moment...
MW
Let’s take Miami Beach.
And you may not be saying Miami
Beach as one of the beaches, but let's
just take Miami Beach. I know Miami Beach right...
BR
Sure, and we typically
like to speak in generalities. So we'll
say we'll say, you know, in 3-5
years, they expect a nourished beach to
wash out.
MW
What does that mean? What does “wash
out” mean?
BR
So if you go and you put in a
certain amount of sand up to a point,
they expect that that had that sand has a life expectancy of X. And it's
really interesting, because the Army
Corps typically projects for 10 years,
but yet we know 62% of the those
coastlines wash out in 3-5.
26% wash out in 1. So, I mean so
that that massive number that I said 737
MW
$737 million
BR
Yeah. When you start realizing
that 62% of that money and
environmental capital is going to just
wash out doing the current thing that
we're doing, it becomes our crisis. That's really bad.
And you know -and just to put it and
probably I would say easy to digest
numbers- Miami Beach specifically put
down, in 2017, they put $11.5
million on just under a mile of
sand, of beach, excuse me. And by 8 -I
guess it was about 8 months later- we
had hurricane Irma, and they lost a
projected of 80% of that $11.5 million.
Then, and so the sand did its job, but
they lost it all.
MW
It was gone. It was gone in a
blink, like in terms of like how long you
thought that was gonna last. A hurricane
wiped it out, and we know based on the
last couple of years, this is gonna
be the deal.
BR
Yeah, so that's your 26% number that
happened to be one time when it just it
went out. Then, in order to get it back,
obviously you know -the state only has, by
the way, a $50 million beach
nourishment budget; you know we have to
make up from the counties, and we have to
make up from from federal in order to do
this- but they then had to apply for
money, again, and then 3 years -took
them 3 years- to put it back on the
beach. And this time, it cost them $16.5 million.
MW
Wow Wow and I
mean you know I think about that
combined with the loss of tourism
revenue right that all of these coastal
towns cities counties are experiencing
lately like that feels like a recipe for
total disaster well it it closes the
beach yeah as well as you know when you
have to put it back it's closed and it's
em and if it happens to be gone then you
don't get to use it there are hotels
that we've got here that we had you know
that when the erosion gets all the way
up to the dune line where are you gonna
put all your beach chairs and how much
food and beverage are you losing you
know every day when you don't have that
150 beach chairs in front of your in
front of your hotel and then when they
do decide to do it you then have three
months of big trucks and you can't go
out there and they're slurry and all
this other things that are going on out
there
so it's so the economic impact of not
taking care of it is astronomical so
that's when you look at a solution like
ours that's gonna help reduce the rate
at which it's washing away it makes a
lot of financial sense not even just on
the people that are buying the sand but
on the community that it's around like
let's let's keep what we got yeah yeah
so so so what do you need in order for
your business to really start to get
some traction what's what's like then
the next key thing that you that you
need yeah we we really need the
Department of Environmental Protection
for every state to get it on board with
us as well as the Army Corps of
Engineers okay and start between the two
of them they need to start really
prescribing and talking about and
applying this to the
when they do that because I'll do it for
each area they always come in and
they'll do a study a monitor and all of
that you know that needs to be the
conversation that needs to happen is we
have to have on a large scale with the
government to do that here in this
country at least Wow man you are you're
you're taking up a big big big big task
man I you know I just like launched a
book and you know I'm trying to get my
book out you're like trying to fix the
coastline it's just like two different
orders of magnitude in terms of like the
problems were tackling but uh man you
know best best of luck to you on it
you know if III asked you before the
before we started the show for the
average person so like we just had this
conversation I feel a ton smarter about
this and I feel like I can have better
conversations with my friends and seem
smart and sort of know some things that
you know people that are working to fix
it and know things that can that can be
done to fix it but I think everyone to
some degree does care about this
everyone loves Miami right you know what
I mean or they love some Beach maybe
they don't love Miami but they love you
know I don't know you know San Diego or
whatever right you know that but they
love a beach right what what can the
average individual who's listening to
this who doesn't work for the Army Corps
of Engineers or doesn't you know have
have buying power at the state's you
know environmental you know group level
what what can the average person do to
contribute to making this happen what
can they do
yeah I that's really about outreach to
your local politicians or to your state
senator or House of Representatives
member and saying we are interested in
either you can name us specifically and
say you know we're interested in
Sherlock and and tell them why you know
and and say look I either I disagree
with the environmental impact or I
disagree with the financing that we're
spending you know I there's been so much
conversation around coral health lately
that maybe that's what the the trigger
is for them to understand that being the
legislature for them to understand how
important it is by saying look if we go
out in there and plant all this coral
and then we nourish the beach and it
diseases and dies then what do we just
do that for you know all of this ocean
it's all really tied in together it's
very integrated and and and that's where
we get it make it happen is legislature
got it yeah I mean it feels like we have
a lot of work to do on the Legislature's
side of things and there's so many
issues this is a big election year so
yeah just yet another reason why civics
are important and why we as citizens
need to continue to try to educate
ourselves not be you know swept up in
the sensational headlines and try to
sort of understand real issues and
importantly understand the narratives
that are going to click with the
politicians right like you said if coral
health is something they're paying
attention to now and they understand and
it's a talking point use that if you
know the economy is a talking point
which it always is who's that right you
know but use the things that are
actually going to get them to like pay
attention because that's that's the game
that's the game we're playing there it
is clean thanks so much man I appreciate
it I learned a ton in the last 45
minutes prep time as well as on this on
this call and you know I think everyone
who's listening will have learned as
well so thanks and best of luck to you
and for you out there if you're if
you're watching or listening and you
want to learn more about Sherlock or you
want to follow Blaine because you
thought he was really smart and he has a
lot of things to say about this topic
you can follow him at Blaine Ross on
Twitter at Blaine underscore Ross and
then Sherlock comm is the website for
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online everywhere at Marcus Whitney or
go to Marcus Whitney comm that's it I
will see you again tomorrow with another
episode of Marcus Whitney live until
then let's build the new normal y'all
peace